My problem is with it taking MONTHS of run around after the issue is handled to the FAAs satisfaction per the conditions they themselves tell us we need to meet. Because of the Medical, no physician is my friend and neither are their nurses because they can enter accurate or inaccurate information into your record either one of which will condemn you. dangerous individuals about whom one reads in the news at 10. The 1320 pound (600 Kg) limit is based on the European standard, I think. There are two schools of thought on this issue: 'If you wanna fly, you gotta lie' versus 'honesty is always the best policy.' It may be that some of you folks are not involved as subcontractors to the Airframe manufacturers. If you have vision with only one eye, you can get a Statement of Demonstrated Ability (SODA) by taking a Medical Flight Test. At least three questions on the FAA medical application (Form 8500-8) can identify to the FAA that an individual potentially has a history of ADHD. Federal Air Surgeon Jon Jordan is very aware of the FAA fear factor among pilots who worry about the potential consequences of filling out the form truthfully. The system is imperfect in many ways and should be fixed, I do not disagree with that. He was convinced if he had the physical and they discovered something bad, hed have to admit it to the AME. I am not sure whether the doctors are always correct or what specifically they are looking for to justify one pilot is medically fit while another is unfit. You are there to take away joy and livelihood. SOO going by the statistic that YOU pointed outof very few incidents and the comments that have been made that alot of piolts tell little white lies to an AME to keep their medical . However, if you do get caught, at best you will lose your license. I was not asked or tested for alertness. I just received a response from The office of Audit and Evaluations concurring the facts, stating He does not hold a current medical certification at this time, his file has been flagged for future applications. Find one that will work with you to meet the necessary requirements, but lying is not an option. Bungee jumping. Why would I want to go through the unbelievable hassle of explaining myself to a bunch of know-nothing bureaucrats and internal medicine doctors who dont know their ass from their elbow about depression beyond some laughably simplistic characterization of the disorder in a diagnostics manual? Oh yeah did I mention that I live in an isolated community and that the next mediocre doc is a good four hour drive away? The word EVER in the forms will toss you through a buttload of psychological tests you will be sorry you were ever honest. It does happen. The only variable is about what. Dr. House. I manage my health daily so as to not have to place them in a position to yank my ticket or otherwise cause me not to self certify. The best advice we can give you is to visit an aviation medical examiner (AME). Im not trying to be deceitful, but I really want to be prepared for this interview and I dont see the importance of something that wont effect flying. It has caused unnecessary pain and inhibits its mission to promote aviation. Out of those, the number of GA deaths from medical incapacitation is tiny. We report, you decipher. Further, you fly with your family and maybe some of your employees if you use an aircraft for business transporation. Those that are honest will remain so, and those who arent never will be honest. Given how stress, marriage pressures, work distractions, fatigue and the hopelessly useless pee in cops cut, phony eye exam work, the self certification (which good pilots do anyway) and lack of medical accident experience with LSA, the fat, useless, overpaid FAA administrators should just go away in favor of drivers license. No, most pilots have few issues. A highly experienced AME, also a 747/DC-10 Captain for a major airline, once told me that crewmembers lose consciousness in the seat about half a dozen times every year. If you have a medical issue, may god be with you as you try to figure out exactly what you have to do (e.g. I got my ticket after age 50. Wouldnt tell you if I had a peg leg and a glass eye. Well maybe a little? Hell no. Misdiagnosed with epilepsy. It only came after I got out of the loop and had the hospital send the info straight to OK. You know how we all type up our medical records now, at least they think so. whether, in their life, have they been diagnosed with, had, or presently have a history of ADHD. If you cannot read the serial number plate on the airplane that just flew by you then you should not be allowed to fly. Stay up to date with the latest articles and selections from our archives. The AME will then be required to report any changes to the FAA, If not, there is no need to report to the FAA. Its a basic truth of the human condition that everybody lies. Its just not opening an unnecessary can of worms. The FAA gives final denial to only 0.01% of applications. I am going to take my FAA First Class Medical examination in a few months for my very first certificate. I live in the UK and the medical over here for a pilot licence, they dont do an EEG. In fact, as I write this, I see over on the corner of my screen a tweet entitled Older pilots are safe pilots. FAA Current Detailed Clinical Progress Notes. Then we really would have a pilot shortage, now wouldnt we. I am 55. The FAA revised 61.53 to include under this prohibition sport pilots who use a current and valid U.S. drivers license as medical qualification.. Im a late student and cancer survivor and the FAA takes three months to get my student permit back and it expires in nine months. Seems arbitrary to me. Don't undergo a physical exam if you suspect you might be disqualified. The only truthful answer is yes, most every night. Your email address will not be published. When a government becomes oppressive, intransigent, and unreasonable, allowing no recourse beyond its edicts, eventually people react. Duuuuuuuuuh do fat babies fart? Hmm cant spell worth a darn mostly dumb fingers will that get me rejected??? You are very nave about physicians income from doing FAA medicals. Not just surprise test changes from the FAA but the FMCSA again wanting to reduce truck drivers hours of service due to fatigue despite the lack of evidence published on the FMCSAs own web site. Be careful that if you have seen your doctor and are responding yes to question 19 and your doctor diagnosed you with ADHD (or suggested that you had ADHD), you will also likely need to respond yes to question 18m. The next hell will be finding out what conditions they place on that SI. Like many organizations, the FAA puts its own authority, power and existence ahead of those, whom it is supposed to serve. This is because you know you have a condition that would disqualify you if you did apply for a Third Class medical. Yet there is no medical requirement for any of these. The 8500-8 of necessity must be brief and it is very difficult to get authorization to change it. Responding to a letter from the FAA about your medical certificate almost always requires you to provide detailed notes from your treating physician(s) and other objective evidence to show you are safe to fly. A good AME will tell you how to jump through the hoops so that when you go for your FAA medical certificate, you have all the data needed for the FAA. I do recommend that you do ask your AME any questions regarding your medications and or your medical history and assist in the gathering of medical records relating to what condition you may have and also the same for your arrest/and or correctional history to explain why on the medical form in the explanations page. They have little to do but think up new restrictions, all under the banner of safety. According to Pilot Self-Grounding Requirements (CFR 61.53), pilots have the duty to ground themselves and report to the FAA any changes in their medical condition before they are able to fly again. If you ever need to submit medical records to the FAA, they will review everything you give them. Personally, I feel that if I am medically safe enough to drive then I should be safe enough to fly. But knowing that the FAA has little humor, we all put no. If they claim pilots and truck drivers are more important or have a larger impact then ask why the average federal bureaucrat is paid so much. Find a Senior AME in your area, call and ask to speak to the AME about your problem. Wish I would have! Is Medical Coding The Same As Medical Transcription? You miss the point. No he should not have been grounded. The real problem was that I also am prescribed anti-diarrhea medication and I take it as needed. Unfortunatley I have seen too many accident reports where the pilot was on prescription medications (found during the toxicological examination)many of them disqulifying, and none of them were reported on the medical application. You and I both know our government never needs to justify their efforts.lol. I hope the FAA box didnt kill more. I am very curious. Yes its very rare for someone to have heart attack or neurological brain seizure in flight. This is very true if you were to tell them everything that has happened to you in the past medical histories etc. Its long and complex, but an occasional look at it, especially regarding your own health issues, is worth it. That resulted in the rejection of my 2010 medical! From open heart surgery and stroke to PTSD and diabetes, it is possible to qualify for an FAA medical certificate with more conditions than most pilots suspect. Most people fall into the trap thinking that one DUI will prevent them from getting their medical, or they fear it will make it difficult to get. Just like the annual inspection on the aircraft, when it was signed off everything was supposed to be airworthy, what happens after that is anyones guess. At worse, you may face a hefty fine or even criminal prosecution. What the FAA is looking for are patterns of behavior that suggest pathological conditions that may lead to gross negligence or unsafe decisions regarding flying. Some do it by mistake. What next, psych eval, cholesterol screen for atherosclerosis, denying smokers because risk of copd exacerbation in unexpected decompression, genetic screening to predict addictive personality or anger tendency? I have been flying with a special issuance 3rd class physical for 15 years. The FAA will catch the application when it comes across due to the flags. Furthermore, any standard of medical concern for pilots is lost because it allows the FAA to turn a blind eye to a medical condition. Last summer I went to get my 3rd class med. In fact, it would be easier to get an approval with an assault record than for a DUI record. Have tried the polite calling routine, found they will lie to you, one time the lady told me my SI was approved & mailed 2 days prior, when I finally got it 3 weeks later the post mark date proved they had lied. The smart ones do. While my husband sailed through after having lied. I am a rental pilot as well, and unfortunately, there are no sport rentals available, and they are too expensive to buy. in detail and conduct a physical exam. The information provided on this website is not intended to be a replacement or substitute for professional medical advice. Some justify white lies by rationalizing they would just be wasting everyones time and effort by disclosing minor issues. In certain circumstances, I wouldnt think twice about lying on the medical form, quite frankly. Most those fellas at the FAA seem pretty smart, but they must be pretty spineless too. Bottom line, you are better off disclosing to the FAA if you want a 1st, 2nd, or 3rd class medical certificate. At 60 years of age you do not want to become an airline pilot you just want to be able to go up fly around and come back again. People, in general, are in better health than they were 20-30 years ago, largely by not smoking, watching their weight, eating less fatty foods, etc. There are too many who are afraid of liability. Always wondered if the stress from taking the medical had anything to do with it. Theres also the issue of things that a doctor may speculate on that they have no training or qualifications to formally diagnose. That cost me about six months of flying. Who would you send them to? The list of silliness just goes on and on. Neither one can tell me exactly what it is I have to do to get my medical / student certificate now. I am going to start a letter campaign to ask the people who can make this happen (our elected officials), to get behind it and make it happen quickly. Additionally, I believe this would be a tremendous economic boon for the industry as a whole. Age is only a number. I showed him on the form. Its sad. I can meet Class 1 if I fib. The FAA is hopelessly stuck in the stone age, especially in the Aeromedical division. Please type or print legibly and remember to sign and date the request. Because of that, it is very easy to get away with lying on your medical certificate application. It is none of their business. What is 1st 2nd and 3rd class FAA medical? They will also review how your current application compares to the ones you have submitted in the past and your driving record. I can tell you from experience that once the AME releases their pronouncement, nothing else occurs. People, in general, are in better health than they were 20-30 years ago, largely by not smoking, watching their weight, eating less fatty foods, etc. Do you need a medical to operate a large motor home, car, boat, sand dune buggy, tractor, motorcycle, etc, etc. Logic dictates that if the medical requirement did not exist, the number of incapacitations would be somewhat higher. Pilot medicals are in the news again, with a proposal by EAA and AOPA to let more pilots use a drivers license for their medical. The FAA medical certification process starts when you fill out an electronic application in MedXPress. Takes the wind out of your sails. Did you know that most of the articles at Air Facts are written by readers like you? Yes, I lie about the counseling part. Typical government bull-. Drowning deaths 2400 All FAA medical certificate applicants are required to acknowledge that warning before submitting their application in MedXPress. This is done by directly contacting you the pilot. Make the FAA do a special issue for every single pilot in the country. Thats out of tens of millions of flights. So, easing up on the medical requirements would be based on real world situations. From the archives: how valuable are check rides? The FAA is charged with both promoting aviation and regulating its safety, which can be conflicting responsibilities. Next, instead of the Class 3 Medical Certificate being good for 5 years until age 40 when it decreases to 2 years, make the decrease more gradual. The FAA can get your records from Social Security if you are on Medicare. He then went on to work for the leading aviation magazines, including as editor of both AOPA Pilot and Flying. Generally, first-class is designed for the airline transport pilot; second-class for the commercial pilot; and third-class for the student, recreational and private pilot. Some of us just have problems in our lives that are difficult to deal with. Sorry for apparently differing from the crowd on this, but I think people are nuts if they are lying. Please remember, he has a liability also. You want to make it more difficult? FAA sets up high-level alerts for missed airline inspections, Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information. Throwaway account for obvious reasons. It is against the APC Forum Rules to advocate any labor action which is not authorized by the RLA/NMB. Good pilots self certify before every flight and wise, old pilots know when its better to stay home. I am probably am the only one who will answer that I like to go for the medical because if forces me to go to the doctor. I reported controlled hypertension on my questionnaire. And the FAAs restrictions regarding SSRIs effectively make it impossible for use by commercial pilots. I do not think that there is anybody who does not lie or has not lied at one time or another. Regardless of whether they lie or not, the system seems to be working there seem to be very few (if any) crashes or incidents related to pilot incapacitation that they FAA/NTSB can point to a problem that should have come in a medical. It has little to do with Health. I was told at a young age I could not fly with one eye, but latter in life I found out I could with a medical waver. I think that increasing the value of a worn out C150 to about $100K (which would happen the day they were included in the category) would take most of the trainer fleet out of circulation and the already paultry number of students would dry up completely. what tests you need, when you need to take these tests, etc) to satisfy the FAA that youre good to go. It's better to try to resolve a condition first than to risk having your application rejected or delayed for months by the FAA. It sometimes gets people injured and sometimes gets people killed. Ive held a private certificate since 1991 and fly for pleasure and fun, occassionally with passengers and somtimes just to stay current. I dont care who you are if you tell me that you have never been diagnosed with anything then you are the liar. NONE . The guy who is lying about hypertension is making a huge mistake. He exists to remove one of the joys of my life. A. You would not be alone, as there are many older pilots that fly with conditions that would disqualify them from getting the Third Class medical. Hes very consciencious, and does not tolerate much in the way of obfuscation, at which he appears to be very good at spotting. The current system not only encourages dishonesty, it encourages pilots to avoid medical treatment and ignore symptoms. If you didnt say yes then you lied. Brian, you are right on about AMEs being able to grease the wheels for pilots with the FAA medical people. Additionally, the one who was honest is punished. Ive no choice but be truthfull,but I am sure Ive flown with other pilots who are afraid of admitting or just dont admit that they are not fit to fly themselves or their passengers safely.Does that ache youve been noticing or even worse ignoring mean something? Again, Im not arguing against the need for medical certification, but the process needs some serious streamlining. A separate authorization request is required for each record released to any third party (physician, insurance company, employer, etc.) I have read articles online about pilots who get caught falsifying their medical. Telling the truth in MedXPress is clearly the right thing to do, but that is not what this article is about. Pilot organizations offer free advice to members, commercial outfits offer advice and assistance for a fee and printed resources are available. Ultimately, if you have a condition that you know will result in denial, become a sport pilot. @Brian B. All because of a blood pressure medication I put on my 2012 medical form. He started his career working with his father, Leighton Collins, at the original Air Facts magazine. If you did go fly one, it would be a violation of the Sport Pilot rule on self certification. maybe for some people want or need to lie, I jus cant do that..ur only foolin urself..I wud feel better knowin Im ok,,by bein checked..by doc,least bp anyway..if I dont feel good to drive then I wouldnt feel good to fly either..i know first hand,retired truck driver,been there done that,also their silent killers.pays to be checked by ur own doc..have idea where u stand medically.. get off fried foods n dont smoke is a BIG HELP..when I dont lie I feel better bout it too. the more you say no the more you are hurting your own self. They, and AOPA, worked with me to get it corrected. 614-497-4088 Pilots also fly without annual inspections, insurance and they might even go flying without getting a briefing first. Otherwise I tend to be so healthy that I simply wouldnt ever go to the doctor. Flying brought some much needed joy back into my life. I refer them to my TMI rule; if it was transient, dont say it. Some records reviewer in OKC can not guarantee those in my aircraft a safe journey only I can do that. FAX your completed Request for Airman Medical Records Form to (405) 954-9326. I lost my career as an airline pilot (major airline) and my life spiraled out of control. You may think you told the truth but you absolutely did not. Local Oklahoma City Area: (405) 954-3261. I go to sleep. Water under the bridge now 19 years later. Now Ive been unemployed for a couple months and who knows how long before some beaurucrat decides to actually look at my file snd say ok. Ive followed all the steps they dictated,all my tests and results are right on but because they wont simply look and see that Ive followed thrie rules and was honest,Im looking at becoming a burden to the system and living on public assistance until I get my medical back. In this case, you can cast doubt on the original diagnosis and attempt to avoid further evaluation. The system does work though. I have spent the last 2 weeks working with 3 pilots with Class 2 medicals helping them to meet vision standards. They are busy guarding the barn only after the horse is back inside. It is already hard enough to convince the FAA that you are healthy enough to fly after dealing with lifes curve balls. Thats if they even decide to give you a medical waiver. Type II diabetes, coronary artery stents, history of myocardial infarction (heart attack), various cancers, and several other diseases are disqualifying, but Special Issuance can be obtained by doing the hoop jumping that the FAA requires, such as providing a statement from your treating physician, listing the medications that you take, do you have any side effects from the medications, do the medications actually work. I was just having so much fun and I didnt realize just how difficult it was going to be. speaks to mental disorders of any sort. It goes on to give examples of depression, anxiety, etc. The FAA typically expects applicants to also identify at question 18m. Both have risks. Even when telling the truth the FAA doesnt give the AME the power to decide. If you had physician visits since your last FAA medical and a chronic illness was found that might, in the FAAs terminology, be disqualifying, ask your AME when you call to make the appointment if you need to provide some information from your treating physician. He never lied. The states set the standards for driver licenses and the Feds set the standards for pilot medical certificates and pilot certificates. Most major airlines are in negotiations at this time, and many are contentious. I dont know if all pilots lie during medicals, but I do know of one who did. And the Medical Flight Test needs to be taken only once and the SODA is good indefinitely. Regardless of whether or not you would get caught, a better question to ask is why would you try to get away with it? An aircraft is just another machine. We have a very good AME in our area. It is strongly advised that you seek the opinion and advice of a qualified aviation medical examiner and appropriate medical physician for any medical needs you may have. That is when the truth will come out. Of those, only a very small % are from medical causes. I will follow that up with a word of warning. G E King, Few people have memory of everything diagnosed as a child, how many appoinments one has been to in the last 3 years, or even knowledge of what the doctor has put in your medical record. Nonetheless, the posts are very short for novices. The med examination wasnt any different from the third class but the vision requirements are different. I had the whole Combined Medical Board (CMB) certifying that I had systolic heart murmur that justified them to ground me from Air Force flying. In our opinion, and even for a moment disregarding the morality of lying and putting yourself, your passengers, and anyone elses safety at risk, it simply isnt worth lying despite the low chances of getting caught. I was always amazed at the high volume the Captains required. What Are the Chances of Getting Caught Lying on an FAA Medical? The questionaire is so impossible to answer honestly because it uses the word ever. Can you say, Martha Stewart?, I do think that the First and Second class medical criteria should be more stringent.. The whole thing is about safety but the FAA has never proven the need for the medicals, especially the third class, it was just randomly instituted one day a long time ago. I lost my 2012 medical cert in Istanbul, and make the mistake of sending the FAA form requesting a duplicate. The FAAs denial letter may look daunting, but time and time again, airmen with a history of ADHD are being issued medical certification following the appropriate presentation of the airmens fitness for flight. Yeah thought so. If I remember correctly, being off antidepressant medication for 6 months or longer makes the problem that required the medication no longer an issue. You never know what will happen to a pilot in flight with his medical conditions. As for lying on the medical form, lies can be undiscovered for a lifetime of flying, but if there is an incident or accident, the FAA and/or NTSB will dredge up every doctor visit, medication, hospitalization they can. Is the medical for safety or for what other purpose? We have been contacted by major union legal teams regarding this issue. If a question comes up about whether or not a pilot is qualified to hold an FAA medical certificate, the application itself usually does not contain enough information for AMCD to make a truly informed decision. I agree the sport licensse should include at least up to a 152, super cub and all two seat trainers. Hey Guys as you know there is nothing private on the internet. I completely agree with you. Joined APC: Jan 2013 . Im OK now, sleep with a CPAP machine. Make no mistake: Form 8500-8 is a legal instrument, unlike many other documents. However, the overriding principle here is that if you intentionally falsify your medical and are discovered, then you are done permanently. If the FAA finds out that you failed to disclose something that you should have disclosed, not only does it mean that you can lose your license, but you may also face a hefty fine or even criminal prosecution. However, when it comes to flying without another capable pilot on board.only friends and family..that is another matter. By now most of you know there are way too many federal employees standing around over paid and coming up with way too many regulations to try and justify their job. Some Pilots tend to lie some just do not get medicals. I do medicals on two pilots who went on a vigorous diet and lost weight. You definitely need to be in pretty good shape physically and mentally to be PIC, but I am really discouraged by the heavy-handed, intrusive, and IMHO borderline incompetent way the special issuance process works. Sorry, screwing around with Oklahoma City since May 2011 (not 2010). Now a question: Should 80+ year old pilots with type II diabetes, hypertension, a coronary artery stent or two, on 3-4 medications be allowed to fly a 6000# gross weight airplane with 5 passengers up to 14,000 feet, VFR or IFR without having had a medical exam by an AME? People are who they are. The SIC will pull the body out of HIS brand new seat. It can also ensure you keep flying for years to come. That would translate into 45-50 deaths a year. Politicians create government agencies empowered to rule by edict. Federal Aviation Regulations require that a pilots distant vision be 20 /20 or better, with or without correction, in EACH eye separately to hold a first or second class medical certificate. If you don't disclose it the likelihood that they find out about it are pretty slim, though. I am a physician instrument pilot with an appreciation for medical limitations. Anyone who would report this immediately loses their medical and has to wait a year. The problem is I was diagnosed with ADHD back when I was about 9. Find one that will help you get through the maze, not simply hand your problem off to the FAA. Even if you can disprove a legitimate history or diagnosis of ADHD (discussed further below), use of a disqualifying medication within 90 days of application will usually lead to a denial. I started flying and was completely awe-stricken. How is THAT not a red flag to someone??? Contact an aviation medical examiner (AME) early if you have doubts or questions. 99.999999% of pilots can and should self-certify for 3rd class flying. 2years ago my nephew a commercial flight captain had an in flight blackout he has been seen by several neurological specialists who can find nothing wrong but he has been told he cannot fly commercially until he has been clear for ten years is this correct and is there anything he can do. He was the author of numerous books, including. The same diseases that the FAA uses to ground pilots should restrict driving. I was dumb enough to tell them about my marriage counseling! Well, I believe we should have to have a medical to operate a car, a motorcycle, a truck, a bus, a train or any type of machine that is exposed to or involved in transportation. I need some advice from experienced pilots / medical professionals about a problem. It is so easy for those not flying professionally to prescribe stricter rules for those that do. I have been asymptomatic for all of those years and I am on no medication. None of the above activities has any significant medical requirement. I think its a very poor decision to falsify your medical. In-case if you ever get into an accident the FAA/NTSB will look through all your medical history and do a thorough check on that pilot meaning they want to look at every doctor visit and all medications you have been on. If you are stupid and want to wait months for a medical waiver. The FAA has created an atmosphere that not only encourages problems to go unchecked and unreported, but actually makes some of those problems worse by discouraging pilots from addressing them, instead allowing them to fester. He proceeded to read off the list and after a half dozen items to which I responded No, he said You wouldnt tell me if you had any of these, would you?
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chances of getting caught lying on faa medical