With their leadership training, it appears that men like Hybels and MacDonald groom charismatic potential leaders in how to control and manipulate naive, trusting believers for their own personal, or the institutions, gain. The Bible(s) of the Christian church is a very big and complex book, much of it written by men who never met Jesus, nor met anyone who heard Jesus teach. What is harvest in the Bible? So do you think this is something like Stockholm Syndrome? So yeah, theres really NOBODY looking over Driscolls shoulder. Praise God for TWW and other watchblogs who do their best to get the word out on these guys, but you cant stop the spiritually illiterate from attending their exciting churches. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. So I want to say Than. There are about 4 dozen Harvest execs & elders moving on to other ministries and the corruption runs so deep theres no chance they wont be infecting every ministry they touch going forward. So why not allow comments? . +++++++++++++++++++. The Chosen is similar to Risen, the excellent faith -based film that . As Law Prof noted, JMac is not your usual run-of-the-mill preacher he had an international stage he had thousands of followers he failed you, HBC, and the church at large he has disqualified himself from ministry. I am willing to bet that MacDonald has been on the horn with Driscoll to see how he transitioned to Scottsdale after Mars Hill imploded. Reported that Camp Harvest lost over $200,000 in 2016. Lowlandseer: I do sometimes wonder if we read the same Bible. And your husband whos probably going through a rough one. I am sorry you and your family experienced that. Our pastor, weeping, said it was one of the greatest movies he ever saw. After seven years, the growing congregation of 500 raised funds in six weeks to secure a former warehouse at 800 S Rohlwing Road in Rolling Meadows. Theres so much we dont know. Noevangelical, lets get a bunch of our favorite beverages, cheese, olives, chocolate, cigars and a candle and well continue on. About a year ago, Jenkins stepped off the Moody Board of Trustees. If you believe you have been financially defrauded, we want to hear from you. Whether its a yes-man or someone the lead guy has dirt on, its easy enough for these types to have a handful in pocket. The mega-masters vocalize Jesus occasionally and even talk about Him from a gospel vantage point. As the author of one of the synoptic gospels, the compiler of early acts of the original Apostles, and the traveling companion of Paul, wouldnt he be the one mostly responsible for letting Paul get away with it? He is best known as the creator, director and co-writer of The Chosen, the first multi-season series about the life of Jesus of Nazareth. The lampstand was removed a long time ago. 3/1/2023 - 7:00pm-8:00pm. This is called domestication. Check her Twitter. I guess its all a matter of perspective. If all this was that important to the leaders they would have been apoplectic at what they witnessed from JM. He has disqualified himself from the office of pastor, he forfeited his right to that sacred office, he used and abused those he should have been accountable to, he betrayed the trust of his followers, he squandered their tithes and offerings. Have seen the exact same thing. Note, I am using my name.. Amen. dee: along with all the boys at SEBTS who dont want to leave the area so there are popup churches in every strip mall. This is something that all Christians in a church community should take to heart. Jenkins's career is focused on faith-based media. ++++++++++++++++++++++. The Gospel in what it means has become the most ridiculous word, exploited, twisted, distorted, co-opted by ridiculous christians. Elsewhere on this thread I talked about a situation where itd be cruel imo to air public matters. Then, Rick Donald, James MacDonald, and Elder Steve Huston worked to suppress them from the rest of the Elders. holding fast the faithful word That set-up is far from the Biblical model of doing church and is a recipe for disaster, especially when it reaches mega-status. What I see, I cant un-see; what I know I cant un-know its in my knower! It was given to the elders two months ago. He believes hes entitled, and hes gonna do what hes gonna do, and no bunch of pew-sitting rabble-rousers are gonna get in his way. But there was some dark humor in the hoopla surrounding it. So, out of well over 1600 posts she doesnt allow comments on maybe two and that leads to your rant of a comment? +++++++++++++++. People were dying for this faith from the very beginning, which suggests that it was not merely wishful thinking about some made up traditions. As you might imagine, there have been thousands of additional actors . There does seem to be something in Dallass attitude of a disregard for those who donated the hundreds of millions to make the whole Harvest phenomenon work. For a son dishonors his father, a daughter rises up against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law a mans enemies are the members of his own household. They deserve each other. This verse came to mind: For it is the time for the judgment to have begun from the house of God; and if from us first, what will be the outcome of those disobeying the gospel of God? (1 Peter 4:17) The business-first model that seems so pervasive and knocks down just about any scrutiny until there is videotaped evidence would seem to fit somewhere in that spectrum, no? I agree with those who say that Dee is fair with her control of her blog. So instead of trying to defend these rascals, I prefer to inform and warn the church about the wolves in their midst rather than giving them a break. You wanted your letter to remain in the dark and hoped that no one would know of your hidden statement. Great comment! Gut tells me hes just another narcissist, and this latest incarnation is another game. One would think that 3 years with Jesus ought to be transformative, but the Gospels seem pretty clear that the Twelve were following Jesus at least in part in hope of high office in a future visible kingly reign over Israel. You see, the symbolic meaning of harvest in Scripture encompasses two main areas: God's provision for us and God's blessing for others. Its a good letter Dallas but would have been so much more impactful 2 months ago or even 1 month ago. I dont get the impression that Dee is OK with Hall at all. Years later, the church long ago destroyed by heavy abuse and the former members scattered, a number of them atheists today, that drama pastor is now into the New Age. Its nice to have a multimillionaire dad. Noevangelical: Both HBC & WC had a plurality of elders and a single pastor as the head of their church. etc. Elder Dan George corralled the statements from the authors and distributed to the other Elders. i agree, Paul has worthy things to say that are beneficial. Truly hope you get peace and joy soon. So yeah, theres really NOBODY looking over Driscolls shoulder, Power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely (Lord Acton). Its life giving. This campus is a close-knit family of Christ-followers who are deeply committed to living out the gospel and seeing God use their church to impact their community. Our inaugural ministry in the heart of Chicago began on September 20, 2009, with a mobile campus that met for worship on Sunday nights at a school in Wicker Park. I just found out about it a few minutes ago. God doesnt need Harvest and in fact Id be willing to say the spirit of Jezebel has been leading that place since the early 2000s. i mean, do we actually believe what we say we believe? Craig French: Thanks for confirming the authenticity of the content, Dallas. He was a cynical grandstands and shameless self-promoter. Do like King David did (by writing Psalm 51 and signing his name for eternity) sign your name to your failure then go find some hurting people from Harvest and minister to them. Spot on with your comment. January 19, 2016 Subscribe to Podcast What's in this session? They can be seen all over Evangelicalism. As for your dig at anonymous people, you are hoping to do the same thing. This, along with the embracing of the whole seeker-friendly, mega-church model caused us to leave the church and people we loved, difficult as it was to explain. Your story matches what I hear from lots of people. (no Dallas, Mormons have an occult fake jesus as Lucifer's brother making them accursed per Gal 1) See Dallas own words below: I thought my disgust for James MacDonald was as low as it could go, but when I saw that photo, it took another nosedive. The first step for anyone who insists upon an institution with paid leaders (I would argue against such) is to limit those salaries to moderate living wages, in line with or less than what the majority of their members live with. Very useful and informative. Cool band, relaxed atmosphere, relevant sermons, espresso coffee, come-as-you-are-stay-as-you-are. Many do not seek truth, but whatever best tickles their ears. Harvest Bible Chapel began meeting the Rolling Meadows High School building. the powerbrokers have manipulated everyone to heavily invest their finances, their time, energy, their relationships, and their own life in the institution. If you have questions, concerns, or encouragements for them, they would love to hear from you. I have been following this blog for a while but have not commented until now. Its sad to have lived to such a ripe old age to witness a generation that doesnt respect their elders as they ought. There are some 30,000 Christian denominations and parachurch organizations in the world. None of the Synoptic gospels have that same setup. You and the other TWW regulars feel like family. ANYONE who is still in that place who is not a child or a new believer is complicit and participated in shunning all who left. Why would anyone want to kill a magnificent creature like that? Even during confusion, never-ending drama, attacks and Im a witness that almost everything you re reading and hearing is true.. Then I read actual instructions on the veneration of Elders as of Christ himself. Who do you want to be in Gods sight? Personally, I call bull. in the interest of understanding, can you explain what you mean by grace? As for J.D. I never thought I would say such a thing about a church plant but, these young reformers are more about planting reformed theology, rather than Gospel churches. I send my kids to a school literally run by bullies. I do know from reading the Acts of Perpetua and Felicity (said to have been written in 203) that church leaders argued with each other. Since then, the output of Christ-adoring songs from various worship team members has continued to accelerate. but again, oodles of people also have personal knowledge of the kingdom of God, through knowing God. Law Prof: I think Sinclair Lewis was an emotional infant and had a lot more in common with Elmer Gantry than he had the introspection to see. I had a churchgoer tell me once in a Bible Study to Lighten up Max. In fact, not saying something wouldve been considered enabling and a betrayal of those being hurt.. Not for money or fame but just because you want to show them love. . Ken F (aka Tweed): I only point out that the historical evidence is not what we protestants want it to be. im proud to be human. Didnt Dallas or is there another Jenkins son? Kinda hard to swear praise and honor to the sovereign terminator while feeling sorry for his victims at the same time. This will always happen, there is no way to avoid it. A person who thinks they are qualified, is someone who may need to take some time to discern whether thats true. JMac will tap posterity for prosperity yet again as soon as he reinvents himself. Then, you proceeded to brag on social media about how you werent releasing your full statement and had convinced other men with statements to do the same. For some, that would be a great option. Whats chilling is you can still see the cult hold harvest has on him and others as he desribes his felling in the beginning of the letter. Youre barking your wares to a wised-up crowd, and unlikely to terrify many here. During this season, we are encouraging everyone to give online and that can be done by clicking the button below. As the Lord continued to increase our congregation in depth and number, we outgrew the Rolling Meadows Campus. We only saw the one tomb. This place needs to be shut down. not covetous They stated goal is to also expose hypocrisy and arrogance. Regarding the tragic murder of that bear, I wouldnt be too rough on JMac perhaps he was using that as a witness to draw in rough boys from the streets of Chicago. Through the generosity of the Green family, the founders of Hobby Lobby, we received the entire property for one dollar. Too bad there is not a single human being on the planet that is qualified. Those who are truly qualified (I think) know they are so in need of Gods favor to consistently live that out and are only barely qualified by what God has already done in them to that point. Or would they even care? He says he knows, "from the inside, some of these things that have come out in the public about pastors". * Apparently, many of the leaders sent their kids to Harvest Academy and there is fear that their kids will be thrown out of school, is not only true, but lacks the other fact that those of us employees that DID speak up about MANY things, were gaslighted and slandered. I am beginning to feel like at best it is simply not what Jesus intended for us, as it allows to much anonymity, where the church should be a community And at worst it is laced with risks for massive abuse and corruption. I guess thats why I share my story, in hopes that others can be forewarned. Hundreds of thousands of innocent Christians will be abused UNLESS men and women of integrity stand up and shine the light of truth on Harvest Bible Chapels dirty deeds done in darkness. My understanding is that Driscoll also consulted with Gateway. A group began meeting and praying together in 2011. * Gaga sees them as self-righteous. It is a position of authority and responsibility. Fisher, thank you for those words of life and hope. What in the world is going on? Begin your journey with the prayer. Muff Potter: Youre not alone elastigirl, theres no way I could watch it either. Harvest Christian Academy currently has more than 500 students, more than 60 staff members, and continues to move forward with a high leadership focus. Were more or less on the same page, it sounds like. be a spiritual failure, Some things are not. My Comment was Deleted Concerned for the vulnerable animals safety, he left his own gun by its side. I tracked down the World Magazine article on Jerry Jenkins gambling from which I had gleaned what little info I had and saw that it mentioned that Dallas also participated in online poker, and that another son was a dealer at a real live casino. It just completely sets things up for abusive situations. We should not be surprised that the battle between the false and the true rages on, and should continue to cling to the true, whatever the cost. . The history of church offices is a bit more complicated. His newest outreach into the community is that he will be partnering with a music minister from another local church and they are starting a church service in a bar on Sunday evenings. They are crumbling under their current debt load that FRED saddled them with; still he brags. My writing partner (the burned-out preacher) described it as the best movie I dont ever want to see again. ME GREAT WHITE HUNTER! Reading Dallas statement (and his posts here) just makes me more angry about what he did. Im also going to be annoyed if James McDonald pulls a Mark Driscoll and starts up a new church. Back Small Group Harvest Kids Harvest Students College Men Women Harvest Worship Disablities Prayer Care Outreach . What they all have in common is serving self interest, whereas the crux of the life and message of Jesus is that the way to life is to lay down self and serve others. Fred Adams earnings $92,434 quite the busy Harvest CFO, http://www.wsop.com/players/profile/?playerid=72494 This article is honest and faithful to what I knew at the time. that exploited the greater public, as well, if you consider how they subsidized the tax-free advantages of Harvest Bible Chapel and its staff. words like unsaved, which always has the connotation of someone to be wary of. His new incognito Floridian Santa Claus look wont stop this. Can you really fault someone for thinking that maybe they got their ideas on Pastors & elders wrong? Sadly, I was guilty of the same in my day, taking the word of the pastor that those who left us were never one of us. I read your posts as a searing, agonized, utterly sincere *cri de ceour. All of the above is not an option, but it seems hard to pick one over any other. just He has not let us down, and even now is exposing these wolves. elastigirl: i take no more stock in what paul thinks than i do in what i think. Then when it all comes to an angry pus-filled head and finally pops because the infection is so deep, he decides that things have gone too far and he writes a letter (but a private letter) and gets angry when its shared as a means of supporting the people whove been trying to expose the abuse. What in the world is going on? Just as I have loved you, so you must love one another. part of it a fear of the outside that is purposely cultivated in church environments. That community is you all, for whom I am so grateful! I do sometimes wonder if we read the same Bible. Christian celebrities would have no stage to perform on if they didnt have an audience willing to buy tickets. When she cleared the backlog, the partial Lauren went through along with my original longer one. * Gaga sees them as self-righteous. not violent Turns out that he was looking to fulfill his succession plan all along, and was just cycling thru people until he found one that fit. Dallas Jenkins was a former leader at Harvest Bible Chapel. No judgment from me. But they do eventually turn. Which really Goes against believing in an all powerful creator God almighty. He is currently Director of Media at Harvest Bible Chapel in Chicago, where he directed the award-winning short film "The Ride" and is currently developing multiple feature films. I read an article yesterday about small mainstream churches driven to the wall by the migration to the megas being forced to lease their vacant during the week facilities to small businesses in order to generate enough income to keep the doors open. After the scene, which seemed to drag on and on, pastor walked to the podium and with that quivery, dramatic pastor voice. In a godly biblical hierarchy, what would flow downhill would be love and care. dee: You chose to serve in a church with incredibly stupid, unbiblical and mean people in charge. We find out that the pastor is living in a $2 million house, he said. Mel Gibsons Passion of the Christ is one of the most GRAPHIC and INTENSE and VIOLENT art films ever made. And she is asking everyone to back off. dee: You sound like an attorney who just sent me a letter stating that I posted false statements by a victim. I truly believe God provides the grace for elders to walk in the attributes in 1Tim 3but if a church isnt even looking at those thingsbut rather recommends a person onto an elder board because he/she is strategic or a fundraiser or a CEO or a finance person or a large donor (or whatever nonsensical qualification they THINK they need)this is the departure that I think God says no to. just more places for the wolves to hide. When I did see it, in my home, I was livid that they essentially forced people to go. Just them asking me to become an elder told me something was wrong. Churchgoers in 21st century America are just too gullible to keep these folks out of the pulpit. Tagged Harvest Bible Chapel, James MacDonald | Leave a comment. DallasHow selfishIs it all about you?Or, is your statement for the greater good of countless others? What was your salary Dallas for all your effort to misuse & misappropriate church tithes? Exactly what were people afraid of? Directed by Dallas Jenkins (The Resurrection of Gavin Stone) and distributed by VidAngel Studios, The Chosen has grown to become the largest crowdfunded TV series of all time. Trust (Cambridge Dictionary): to believe that someone is good and honest and will not harm you, or that something is safe and reliable. Every weekend were gathering to open the Bible together, growing in Gods ways through community and going out to bring God glory through His Son, Jesus Christ. I can only imagine what was said as explanation, particularly as my spouse (still blindly loyal) remained much longer than I, until our children put up a united appeal to leave. Let him call for the elders [PRESBUTEROS] of the church, and let them pray over him (James 5:14). There is no question that MacDonald was running the elders. So many things bring to mind what Leah Remini is bringing to light. Cool bands, espresso coffee, relevant sermons, fun and fellowship, etc, In the words of the Prophets Emerson, Lake, and Palmer: First Church Plant - Harvest Bible Fellowship "Do Theologians LIke Russell Moore Ever Apologize for Theological Blunders of the Past?" And the same verses in a different Bible, the ESV: 5 And when you pray, you must not be like the hypocrites. Too much I and not enough we in there. Its Greshams law applied to religion: bad drives out good. He stands to shield me from danger Hall, Ive been consistent here and elsewhere under another net handle and under my actual name that I dont think the guys up to any good at all, either years ago or now. My family faced a similar situation years ago. But this just doesnt seem to fit. You were *in charge* so to speak for years. 4107 N Steele Blvd. TS00: Agreed. This cancer is about to metastasize across the U.S. and ALL of the dirt needs to be made public for the safety and spiritual well-being of the masses. Churchgoers in 21st century America are just too gullible to keep these folks out of the pulpit. That would have been ample to time to realize what they had got themselves into, to determine who MacDonald really was, and become aware of the hypocritical mission of HBC and its leaders. A people laden with iniquity, offspring of evildoers, children who deal corruptly! (Isaiah 1:4). That brings me great joy, because sometimes I feel pretty alone in this wilderness. Never to leave me alone!. Our musicians have taken to heart the mission, core, and purpose of Vertical Church music: To write songs of ascription for the church to use in worshiping Christ around the world. What would have been the point to allow comments after asking that? We must put our unreserved trust in God alone, and to at least some degree view all men even our most trusted loved ones by their fruits. He added the promise of millions of dollars in renos and expansions, via the Closer Campaign, in order to sweeten the pot. No church will fit that ideal in this fallen world. They been negotiating a retirement package before all the properties foreclose and theres no more cash! . Dallas Jenkins: It was leaked. RAWR!, I doubt that the facts will stop MacDonald from making an unrepentant comeback. Maybe that was why Elmer Gantry had such impact. husband of one wife said THATS what Jesus did for YOU!. I suppose those are the sort of preachers Jesus had in mind when He said: You guys are tempting me to mount my soap box! I do have to apologize for a comment that I made that was based on my faulty memory of the facts. Concerned for the vulnerable animals safety, he left his own gun by its side. I only point out that the historical evidence is not what we protestants want it to be. dee: Its like dj vu all over again. -Yogi Berra, When you come to a fork in the road, take it. -Yogi Berra. All we get is CYA, after the fact, trying to make the best of whats already been leaked. TS00: because sometimes I feel pretty alone in this wilderness. Perhaps its the side deals as well. IMO, most people attend church to replace the lost family and community modern society has sacrificed. We dedicated a new building as the new home for the Crystal Lake Campus in 2008. Is anonymous code for little people or pew peons? Jimmy Evans, Head of Marriage Today TV & Sr Pastor and Apostle of Gateway Church, is reportedly in contact with James MacDonald. The leaders of Harvest clearly did not shin light of problems; in fact it well documented now they were bullies/godfathers supressing thetruth. Im convinced that an antinomian spirit has taken control of some ministries, where church leaders feel they have been released by grace from the obligation of observing the moral law. And to link them together as a Body of Christ, each one uniquely gifted to be a part of the whole something the institutional church just doesnt appear to get. And you sound profoundly arrogant. Because they have no conscience and no moral compass. You have my phone number,. The fellowship network of about 120 churches, many of which still have Harvest in their name . (baby dont hurt me no more) Maybe JMs associates and enablers thought the most loving thing was to go along with JM for the sake of the everlasting benefits in heaven that would be experienced in the future by the people who were being abused, manipulated, fleeced here under the sun, but who nevertheless were hearing the gospel (as they understood gospel), even though it looks to us like it was being preached from false motives. well, there will be more when parts of a belief system dont stand up to reality, its totally bewildering, [theres a word for what im feeling.it escapes me. but i have gained a newfound joy in being a member of the human race. Anyway, this small bit of a sermon doesnt appear to provide much foundational backup for all the rest of the filler in the Bible that supports mega-churches of any denomination. I just think some people do not care one tiny little bit about what the Lord said. Many needy men get their egos stroked, while the women see through the charade. It appears he has been a poser, a bully and a thug for a very long time. Q: Why do narcissists go to seminary? You have any lies and untrue rumors to highlight that are being spread here, out with them. Given His choice of companionship last time He was here, your friend from that Bible study might be shocked. Dee has been at it for over ten years. In April 2016, Harvest acquired a permanent church facility in Aurora to allow the Aurora Campus to continue to grow, both in number and effectiveness in reaching people for Christ. Ive heard the thunder roll. What is significant about Clements first letter is how he describes the church offices as an established fact rather than as something he was trying to invent from scratch. A narcissist is very good at manipulating people, and very patient. You chose to serve in a church with incredibly stupid , unbiblical and mean people in charge. Blaming bloggers and the media for having bad form for discussing the issues, but then admitting that they are true? The way back: 2 Chronicles 7:14 but I dont see much movement in that direction. You should make your case by offering proof. I know we have to hunt to keep down the population of wild creatures, especially in areas where they dont have any natural predators, so they dont destroy the environment and/or starve. the powerbrokers have everyone brainwashed that the insitution is too big to fail. Harvest Bible Church is a non-denominational, non-charismatic, evangelical Protestant church located in Northwest Houston in the Cypress community. , agonized, utterly sincere * cri de ceour on Pastors & elders wrong be.! All your effort to misuse & misappropriate church tithes most ridiculous word, exploited, twisted distorted... Elmer Gantry had such impact, thank you for those words of life and.... 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Willing to buy tickets described it as the best movie I dont see much movement in harvest bible chapel dallas jenkins direction point! Believe what we protestants want it to be pick one over any other craig French: for... You and the other TWW regulars feel like family and starts up a new building the! Then, Rick Donald, James MacDonald, and elder Steve Huston worked to suppress them from authors! To speak for years many do not seek truth, but then admitting that they are?. Failure, some things are not of Trustees pastor, weeping, said it was one the! Berra, when you come to a School literally run by bullies a wised-up crowd and... Group began meeting and praying together in 2011 fit that ideal in this fallen world audience willing to buy.... Church is a bit more complicated just think some people do not seek truth but! James McDonald pulls a Mark Driscoll and starts up a new building as the of... Your wares to a fork in the world her blog people or peons! My story, in my home, I was livid that they are,. Tickles their ears you! did not shin light of problems ; fact...
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